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Benedict 13, Us 11, Vatican 9, Cardinal Dolan 8, Christiane 6, Cardinals 6, Gandolfo 5, John Paul 4, Castel Gandolfo 4, Melinda 4, Beck 4, United States 3, John Xxiii 3, Mary Hughes 3, Prada 3, Becky 3, Christiane Amanpour 2, Brown 2, Monsignor Irwin 2, Mexico 2,
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  CNN    CNN Newsroom    News/Business. Latest on the day's top news stories  
   with a focus on global news, trends and destinations. New.  

    February 28, 2013
    8:00 - 9:00am PST  

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favorite things to look at and talk about, the pope mobile. >> now he's in a benz like every other new york banker. he's making his way to the helicopter. we'll see if father edward beck was even close to his fantasy that he will pilot himself. he is getting full protection. he is the head of the state still until he signs off. >> obviously you've been to the vatican once. i collect passports now. vatican counts because it is a sovereign. >> you cannot have mine. >> two stamps when i went -- >> if that is what it is, you'll have to get your own. >> no, it's very interesting, it is a sovereign state and i think that's something to keep in mind here. castel gandolfo actually is part of that too. it's the same state even though it has two noncontiguous locations. but it is part of the vatican. >> an asset of the holy see. we'll talk about castel gandolfo in a quieter moment. there's some symbolism to this
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also. castel gandolfo has played a really big role in the transition of the church over the years. they lost it for a while. it was given back my mussolini. it's been a different point of relevance over the years and will take on a different relevance today. so the car is traveling right now. we just watched pope benedict leave the vatican. there they are moving along. >> straight to the helicopter is where they're headed. let's go to christiane amanpour and father irwin who are in rome right now sort of in the middle of all of that clapping and celebrating we just saw, christiane. >> reporter: indeed. and off he goes in that car, as you said, at a pretty brisk clip. he's going to the helipad which i'm told is at the vatican train station, if you can believe it and you know better than i that there is a vatican train station. he'll get on the helicopter and go. i just came from the north american college where i interviewed cardinal dolan about half an hour ago and he said, cardinal dolan, that him and many of the other cardinals, the
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american elected cardinals who are going to be staying there are going to go up to the roof to see if they can see the helicopter taking off. we've already seen cardinal turkson of ghana has joined the twitter revolution and he himself from the top of st. peter's behind me has tweeted a picture. perhaps many of them are going up there to see if they can watch the helicopter take off. but look, this is massive. we are watching this in minute detail unfold. why? not just because he's an elderly man who's decided to resign but because he's the leader of 1.2 billion people, not just the leader of catholics but somebody when he speaks, when he moves, when he makes pronouncements, when he receives heads of state and talks and pronounces on international affairs or affairs that affect our daily lives, affairs of science, of education, of theology, it really makes a difference. for better or for worse, it makes a difference, monsignor. >> he speaks with authority, not power. that's the kind of man he is. the logic, the integrity, the
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insights, and the world has listened to him and he inherited from john paul a stage. he filled it not quite as largely but filled it very adequately with the authority of his teachings, not by power. >> reporter: and when we say listen to him, the world listens to the pope, whether it is benedict, john paul or whoever the next one might be. >> well, as a matter of fact, that's true. succession is the word. one succeeded the other succeeded the other on the basis of what we believe. >> reporter: we talked about it a lot and i talked to cardinal dolan about it. cardinal mccarrick and certainly cardinal dolan plays down any talk of him being the next pope but the fact of an american being the pope does not look like it's in the cards now. >> that's been said for a long time. but to be very honest, i think that the fact that we have taken the lead on the abuse crisis may well be -- may be the joker.
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it may well be that someone looks to having done extraordinary work in that field. >> reporter: and we see also now the pope who has arrived, looks like to me at the helipad area. this again is at the vatican train station where there is a helipad nearby. don't forget that once he looefd leaves, they will seal up the vatican apartments with that yellow papal seal. >> that's right. christiane right now we're seeing the pope has exited his car and is making his way to the helicopter. we're watching it right now. pope benedict xvi. he's left the vatican for the last time. he is greeting the thousands who have come out to see him. the applause has been basically nonstop following him along the way. every one of these is a final moment. he'll never be back to the vatican as pope. he'll never be in that car again. and while they seem like details, they matter. so let's listen in.
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>> we have by the way confirmed father beck wanted to prove himself correct and you did. so he pulled up the report from the catholic news agency which showed in a report from when the pope came here to the united states that he does indeed like to pilot that helicopter himself when he flies from the vatican to the residence. obviously he's not doing that today. i think chris was right, that would have been a step too far. i'm exhausted, i can't do the job. >> that would have been very confusing. then he goes up and does a buzz over the vatican. a very disturbing scene. >> i might like that, the super modern catholic. >> it's such a -- you will never know what's going on inside the pope's mind. he is almost sphynx-like when you look at him. it is tough to discern his own
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thoughts. but imagine for each of these cardinals and these men that he has worked with in his final goodbye to them, in the blessings, something that will stay with them for a lifetime. we're waiting for the rotor to start turning. monsignor, you were saying something earlier? >> normally this transition would be about the death of a pope. and this time there is some sadness here. many of the cardinals this morning spoke of their own sadness. cardinal dolan in particular. and there is in a very personal way for many people because it's not a question that they won't see pope benedict as pope again. he's moving into a reclusive life of prayer. for many, we won't see him ever again. and there is a bit of grieving in this transition that will happen nonetheless. even though he's going to continue to serve the church in prayer, it will be far, far from the public eye and it's not as though he'll be entertaining people at dinners or having guests over on a regular basis.
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>> the rotor is starting to turn. when the helicopter takes off -- >> i was just listening here, the final tweet came in. as you know, the pope joined twitter. he didn't manage the account but he did join twitter and just sent out his final tweet and it is thank you for your love and support. may you always experience the joy that comes from putting christ at the center of your lives. that is the final tweet from pope benedict xvi. >> as pope. now it's up to the new pope to decide whether or not they want to carry on with the pontiff x screen name. >> i'm betting that they will. >> so rotor is going now. the bird is going to take off. 15-minute trip to castel gandolfo, the summer residence. there will be there more of a ceremony. now, we hear the bells ringing there. the next time we will hear those bells -- they ring all the time in rome obviously. but the next time they'll have major significance of course is when the big bell signifies that we have our next pope. so right now they are sending off the pope benedict xvi for the last time, marking time
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there. 5:00 local time, 8:00 local time there will be the end of his papacy. that's the end of his usual work day. also a little window into the strain that he's saying he's looking forward to getting away from. a day that went from very early until 8:00 every day. very taxing, especially for someone his age. >> the bells are ringing now. they're going to ring when the helicopter lands as welch brings me back to what i enjoy so much about all of this is the pomp and circumstance of it. people can be critical, father beck, of the pomp and circumstance of the catholic church, but it is what makes it the catholic church. >> it is what inspires us, right? it lifts our spirit to something more majestic than ourselves. so it really facilitates our prayer, i think. >> it's what andrew greeley used to call the poetry of catholicism that binds us to the church even when we have our problems with it. and i think that's true. and you're also looking at a church that has always known the power of art and the power of art as a pathway to god.
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i mean it's -- you know, the answer to the reformation was really? look at the art of rome, you know, in the counter reformation and get back to us. >> the bird has lifted off, the papal helicopter. >> now, i am interested in helicopters, by the way, chris, and i am curious whether this is an augusta midland. very solid italian made helicopter that you can see through the bottom right in the front and i see that this one can. >> the brains and the control room. >> an augusta midland. >> what do we have? >> just the way he sat in it. by the way, they're very quiet. you don't have to wear head phones and things like that. >> we're getting that answer right now. >> they're thinking erin burnett is the worst person ever asking that question. >> we only know what we can see as the sun is setting in rome. here's the helicopter that holds pope benedict xvi taking a looping route, going back north
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before it's coming back south to go to where castel gandolfo is. on the ground thousands and thousands of people looking up at a man they will never again see as pope. the bells are ringing, the sun is setting, literally and symbolically for pope benedict xvi. this is a 15-minute ride to castel gandolfo, the summer residence of the pope. he's going to do something more ceremonious there. >> the popemobile is waiting and he'll have the final goodbye where he will be on the balcony and say goodbye to all the people who have kong debatcongr
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there. >> when the swiss guard leaves cast l gandolfo, that is the outward sign pope benedict xvi is no longer pope. >> because you love this part of it, you're obsessed with it. >> i am. >> so walk us through it. i know they could have up to ten days before they start the conclave. >> this is a big deal. we've brought in a lot of experts. this is a big deal because the passion is in the process. and we're going to talk about this and get a calendar out. you know once the pope has said his goodbye. obviously nobody wants to rush this moment. it brings such anticipation of what comes next on every level, from what has he told the cardinals. will they get together immediately? we do know that they have come in huge numbers early on. there's something like 140 cardinals present this morning. they already have the entire voting body there. a lot of the process was built in for travel time to rome back in the day when you were on steamer. >> when the pope passed away. >> and you said to get there on donkey or whatever it was, plane, bolt, car, now they're
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all there anyway and it could start immediately. we know this. when he says goodbye, when his papacy ends tonight, they'll have a meeting tomorrow. at that meeting tomorrow, they will announce when the general congregation begins, which is the open discussion of where -- all the things that we believe they have to discuss will start. how long will that last? we don't know. we do know the first order of business is when the conclave will be. and that is when the big moments begin. until then it's all speculation, which is delicious and very, very significant for the church. >> one thing that i found very interesting is when you look at the people who are going to be voting, they are from john paul or pope benedict. in fact more than half of them from pope benedict, so we would imagine the person they are likely to pick would be someone very much like him, conservative? >> well, we don't know that actually because what they'll do in the coming days in the general congregation is look at the issues facing the church, is to determine, as cardinal dolan said in his interview earlier. what kind of leader do we need?
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and pope benedict's resignation words were that he did not have the stamina and strength to deal with the significant matters facing the church today. he didn't identify what those were, but he did point to the fact that there are significant questions. so some of the cardinals may look and say, well, if pope benedict felt that he no longer could do this, is it simply a question of physical stamina, or is there something else that he might have been inferring? >> i still am curious, though, because it just seems that you say they're going to open the door to having a conversation with married priests. you were talking about what cardinal dolan told christiane earlier, father beck. but then i think of homosexuality, the issue of abuse, the issue of women priests, the issue of women in general in the church, and i wonder are they ever really going to deal with it or is this another opportunity -- and you may not see it as a missed one, everyone can disagree on that. but they just won't actually do it? >> you know what, there is no real predicting it.
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when john xxiii was elected, they thought he was going to be a mild italian transitional pope. he called vatican ii. it revolutionized the church. they did not expect that to come from john xxiii. you don't know who you're getting when you elect who you think you're electing. >> kind of like the supreme court. >> you have to leave some room for the unknown in that, i think. >> let's get back to the moment for a second. inside the helicopter, pope benedict xvi, imagine what's going through his mind right now. all the history that he has made in the last several minutes. on the ground thousands of people wishing him well. also thousands of people waiting for him to come to them at castel gandolfo. christiane amanpour, you are now in rome where the pope is now exiting. how is it there? >> reporter: oh, chris, i can't tell you. who would have thought that, first of all, there would be a helicopter following a helicopter and we'd be watching this flight as if it was sort of
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like a car chase but yet it is so dramatic. it's so dramatic. i never thought that it would be like this when the moment came. people are in st. peter's square, they watched all those final moments that we've withbe talking about on a big screen. there have been people waving as the helicopter flies overhead. we just saw it fly overhead us. there it is again, this helicopter that we're going to be watching until it lands at castel gandolfo. but you can't really underplay and underestimate the importance of this moment. we've said over and again that this is an unprecedented event, that the most powerful religious leader in the world, the man with the biggest flock in the world, 1.2 billion catholics, no other faith leader has a flock of that size, voluntarily decided to step down. who does that? it's not re-election. this is about it. we saw him go over the most amazing roman sites, does we, across the coliseum, across the church of the pope. >> i have not been as moved
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until this moment about the resignation. >> reporter: i agree with you. >> i have come to rome for many, many years. he flew over the coliseum, who more do you need. and then over the church. every city in the world has one cathedral. that's his cathedral and that part of the city i -- they knew what they were doing, they always do, taking the pope over his cathedral for the last time. outstanding. >> reporter: honestly again it is moving because this is such a stoic pope. whatever we want to say and we will for many, many days to come about all the challenges that this church faces, how it's been buffeted by the most appalling scandals, nonetheless this is a significant moment and we all want to see the catholic church move forward so the faith can continue their faith in the hierarchy and in those who lead them. but this is a man who is in his public persona the kind who doesn't wear his heart on his sleeve, as our esteemed colleague john allen has
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constantly pointed out. yesterday in his pope mobile in st. peter's square he was quite stoic even then. he kept putting his arms out and embracing the people and you could see the first inklings of emotion pouring out after two weeks he had made this decision to resign. he talked about the gravity of it, the novelty of it and how this was something that, you know, nobody has seen, nobody has had to deal with for more than six or seven centuries. >> and for a different set of reasons. the other pope who returned to the vatican and resigned and left the vatican was seven centuries ago. but this pope's talk yesterday was very different. it was a personal homily reflection on what was happening. and then he admitted that the sea of peter was facing tough times and it has to be reformed. and there were times that he was afraid. we're all afraid. but the pope said that, gives us
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permission to know that god is still with us even if we're afraid. >> as we watch this, christiane, back here in new york, it is a beautiful moment no matter what you believe. it literally is like a postcard for rome. the helicopter has traveled over the most beautiful sights. it is positive, though somewhat somber. but it's interesting to me to watch back here. i'm moved as a journalist, as a catholic. but your faces have changed, monsignor, father, as you've been watching him. what does this mean to you as truer servants? >> it is moving and like monsignor irwin said a couple of minutes ago it really is striking me now that in two hours time, we'll be sede vacante and for a very different set of reasons. i was in rome at the time of the last conclave as a graduate student and was in the square when pope john paul died and was in the square when the smoke went up announcing pope
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benedict's election, so i feel like there's a book end here. but because this is so uncharted, we don't have terms, we don't have policies. it's taken them a week or two to clarify what pope benedict's title will be and how he'll be addressed and what he'll wear. we're in very uncharted waters and it is a little -- there's an excitement about it because there's this question of, well, what could we do? are we going to think outside the box? but there's another piece of how does the church take a step forward from this moment that's so unfamiliar. >> i don't know how this will come out or if i should really even say this, but there hasn't been a lot of times in recent years when i have felt real proud of the roman catholic church with everything we've gone through. but looking at this and seeing this man and what he's done and what he's relinquished for the sake of something else, it gives me a lot of hope and inspires me just to see it. and i feel proud. pride isn't a good thing sometimes but i feel proud to be a priest and a roman catholic
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right now. >> it's a deadly sin, isn't it? >> it is. >> not today. we'll give you a pass. melinda, you cover this. you take a look at this very closely. this idea that what he did is a beautiful gesture and it shows that there can be change. and this at the highest level. many of these issues that we battle with mostly as americans because in other regions of the world, to be fair, we're broadcasting out to the world audience for cnn and cnni, there are many different interests. >> they're not as important. >> celibacy, marriage, dealing with gay marriage. different when you're starving to death as they are in so many developing parts of the world where the catholic church is growing. but this symbol of i am the most powerful and i have done the biggest change, what could it translate to? >> well, this pope was a reluctant pope from the beginning. so when we're talking about, you know, looking at these people who have feelings, feeling
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tthe poignancy of the moment, i see the pope with a big whew. listen to his words. you have borne with me this burden of the ministry. and for someone who does not particularly like being in the spotlight. he's a quiet, academic guy who loves to be writing and reading, i think he feels that he is laying down this burden. >> you think he's already kicked off the red shoes? >> his mexican mocka sins. >> catching up on his fiction? >> as for where we go from here, i think he gave a clue to that too when he said the church is a living body. and that really is an important thing to say because it signals the opportunity for change. meaning the church is always changing. and even though it's kind of gotten lost in the big news of the last couple weeks, there was a pretty massive news break in
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the church just i think it was two weeks ago in germany when the german bishops affirmed a cautious approval for the morning-after pill for rape victims. that's a pretty big shift. >> yes, it is. >> and, you know, when cardinal dolan says, yes, we're going to talk about this, we've always talked about it, he's not really opening the door to a discussion about things like women cardinals, ordination or even birth control, but i think that as you were saying before, you can never know what the next pope is going to do, where the conversation is going to lead, as long as you realize that for what for them are the basics, they're not on the table day one or day 1001. >> you talk of being proud to be a catholic. it's that -- that was a poignant thing to hear you say but we talk about the issues in the united states with catholics. but to the point about the
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church growing around the world, it has been growing around the world. by the way, it's been growing in the united states. so it's about 17% of the world population. 1.2 billion. but the numbers that i found, these are from georgetown, obviously jesuit. half of the population of identified catholics is up 60% since 1965. i know a lot of that is immigration but that's a pretty stunning thing. >> it is stunning. of course it's growing in asia and africa the fastest. which is why many people are saying should the next pope be from the developing world, asia and africa. there are two candidates from both of those places that maybe we'll talk about later. but it would be a nice symbol for catholics around the world if that were to happen. >> let's reset for one moment. if you can, take the shot again that splits the helicopter with the bells. this is beautiful in and of itself. the sun literally bouncing off the papal helicopter. the italian air force helicopter that is taking the pope to castel gandolfo. literally the sunset for pope benedict xvi. the symbolism of the moment
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caught with this split screen you're seeing right now. on the left side, the bells are ringing, they are saying goodbye to the pope. they are also sounding a call for what will come next. next to it, of course, the helicopter. literally riding off into the sunset. >> yes, the sunset in rome. >> pope benedict goes. >> we were watching it go over rome. it then circled back over the vatican, st. peter's, went over the coliseum, went over the airport. that would mean that nobody else is flying in or out of rome right now. >> not right now. it's a 15-minute trip, a very short trip, but it ain't going to be a 15-minute trip this time and i think that's very intentional. the air force, the italian air force chopper, the pope is on board with his secretary. >> we're looking at the landing area for the helicopter in castel gandolfo, which is helicopter looks like it is now approaching. >> this is it. and again, this is all a series, for those finding the interest to watch, of finality.
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these are all end moments. he'll never leave the vatican again, he'll never be on his helicopter again as pope. and in just moments that will be true, which as we've learned here today is of special significance to this pope because as father beck told us, he is a pilot. so it's probably even more meaningful to him that this is the last time he'll be on this helicopter as pope. >> when he gets the gift of -- i know this sounds so layperson but of retirement. of being able to have peace and seclusion and a chance to say goodbye to life, which popes did not tradition talally have. he gets that great gift. here he is. you're now looking at castel gandolfo. there's going to be bells ringing. people are waiting with torches because the sun has set. dusk has approached and there are people waiting in the square outside where he will be addressing them from the balcony. the helicopter, he'll get into the car and go into castel
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gandolfo. >> the pope has touched down. interesting, the signs that we've seen that keep popping up in different languages. they all say the same thing, though, thank you. thank you. that's what they're saying to pope benedict xvi. there's one of those signs right now, danke. >> he'll be addressing them in a few moments when he gets out of the helicopter. they'll let the rotor stop because otherwise he gets out and it blows you. >> he knows that, he's a pilot. >> that's right. >> there's a lot of detail that comes along with him. what he'll wear, who will look after him, where will he be, what will he do. we have answers to that and we'll be discussing it throughout the coverage of this special today. >> when does he change the shoes from red? red signified the bleeding and the sacrifice and he's going to change to brown. >> i think once the retirement is actually in effect this evening.
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>> 8:00? >> yeah. >> you know why they're red? for the blood of the martyrs. the blood of the martyrs, the red shoes. >> and then also he had a gold ring which they are going to -- >> destroy. >> why do you have to destroy it? >> because it has the image of peter on it and he's no longer pope. >> why can't he keep the ring? >> they never want -- >> is it like somebody broke off an engagement. >> the monsignor was talking about this early. >> it's the symbol of his power because in earlier periods, the pope would issue a decree and the ring would have been used to seal in the wax and so the destruction of the ring upon normally the death of the pope symbolized that no one else could use the ring and issue something as a forgery. so today it's symbolic. and there had been some question as to whether they would actually destroy the ring or turn it over to the vatican museums. but they are going to keep with the custom and it will be up to
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the camerlengo after 8:00 tonight. >> do we know who the pope is speaking to right now? he just got off, it's the first man he met with. we know he's going to meet with the mayor of the township. we know he's going to meet with certain heads of clergy. i can't tell if they're clergy from here. obviously he is there and this is the final leg of the pope's trip to castel gandolfo, the summer retreat that we're watching now. >> the formal welcome. >> hear what the italians are saying. can we hear what the italians are saying? [ speaking in foreign language ]
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>> he's talking to certain members of the military, certain members of the clergy there and local governing body. >> he does seem relieved. christiane and monsignor irwin, i know that you're saying how this moment really struck you as you saw the helicopter and how special and amazing it was. but the look on his face when he landed, it was one of relief. >> reporter: it was amazing. amazing. just to let you know who he was actually meeting with and who was greeting him, according to the list that we've been given, there's cardinal bertello, president and govern and bishop who was secondary general and governor and the mayor of castel gandolfo and the parish priest
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of castel gandolfo. and do you know i want to turn to the monsignor for some very important record correcting on the shoes. we have said for years, ever since we watched this pope be elected in 2005, that he was wearing red prada shoes, i'm afraid we have been wrong. >> they are red shoes given to him because constantine gave him the privileges of being an emperor and he allowed him to wear red shoes and a red cape. frankly the papal shoe maker is up the block so it's not prada. so the devil may have worn prada but not this pope. >> reporter: so correcting it on the last day of his papacy. >> and you know the next pair of shoes -- >> the catholic church has done that over the years where it meant one thing for emperors but meant something different for them. >> reporter: there you go. and the next pair of shoes, of course, brown leather ones given to him from his trip to mexico
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by a particular benefactor in mexico. so there we have it. >> he's also giving up his red cape, by the way. he's just going to have a simple white tunic. an interesting side note, when he became pope, they have three sizes of white sutans to fit the pope in. none of them fit pope benedict. >> oh, really? >> it was a major embarrassment for the gamarelli tailors, so they just put a simple white alb on him. he said i'm going to keep my black sweater on. they put a simple white alb over his blast sweater and he went out to the balcony. >> they had a small, medium and large. >> why would not one fit him? >> that is a strange thing. what is he? >> he's not that tall. he's about 5'7". so why they did not have -- they usually have one to fit anybody. >> i know. when john xxiii was fitted, he was too big and they had to let the seam out in the back and
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they held it together with pins. >> and it wasn't a surprise that he was the choice in that time. >> exactly. so why weren't they more ready for that? >> he was the front runner. >> a mystery. >> but there was some talk they were going to dump those tailors after that and they were there for centuries, but they didn't dump them. >> we'll get becky ready. she's outside castel gandolfo because obviously the motorcade full of security because he's the head of state, which he still is, moving toward castel gandolfo. let's see what the mood is like on the ground there of those who await him. becky, how is it there now? >> reporter: it's quite an atmosphere. the helicopter that delivered the pope and a number of his staff now just taking off to go back to rome above me, and we are looking at pictures of a five-car convoy with one outright bringing pope benedict from the helicopter up to here. castel gandolfo. it's about a two kilometer drive. he'll arrive here and almost
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immediately come to this window here where there are 10,000 people, almost everybody who lives in this town, are waiting what is an honored guest for the next few months. you can hear the helicopter just above me now. quite an atmosphere. they have been praying the rosary for some time here and it's been a very quiet and contemplative mood. but now people beginning to make a little bit of noise as they anticipate the arrival. as i say there at the window of pope benedict xvi. he is still called that, of course, until 8:00 tonight when these doors behind me will close. when the swiss guard will abandon their position and he will become benedict, his holiness. that will be a signal that he is now a retired pope, the first to retire in 600 years. cheers for the helicopter there. i can show you the shot. show you the shot.
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it may have been the accompanying helicopter. there was the italian air force were accompanying the pope and actually getting the video that we've been watching for the world's eyes. but there you go. >> becky, here's the pope now? >> reporter: can you hear me? >> i can hear you, becky. the pope has gotten out of his car, he's walking in now. another major part of the moment here, moving under his own power into castel gandolfo. that is, as we should know by now, the summer residence for the pope. massive place. massive building but also massive place. 110 acres. what we're waiting for now is he's going to go in, get situated, greet the staff there and he will make an appearance out on that little terrace that they have prepared for him to come out and wave to people there. >> and his benediction, his goodbye. >> and all these people gathered. interestingly becky said earlier on she estimated close to 10,000 people there waiting. the population of the place is
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not 10,000. >> no, 9,000 or something like that. >> so all it can hold and then some. >> and they would thought they would have about 7,000. i don't know where they derived that number but obviously even more people than they thought are there waiting for him. as chris has said, i believe, i don't know what language that was, german? well, it said thank you. as chris said so many signs that we have seen in every language have said thank you. and that's where he's going to come out on the balcony. which for me is one of the -- whether it's -- obviously we've never seen this before here, but when you see it in rome, that's the special moment when you hear the roar of the crowd and then the silence. >> you know, it's interesting. people can watch this moment and say i don't care, i'm not a catholic or i don't like what the church has done. all i'm saying is this, as a reporter and an observer of the world around us, name another moment that we have witnessed of this caliber and kind? and by that i mean nothing --
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let's take religion out of it. a potentate of a huge body, who as ceded power voluntarily, absent any real stress or pressure other than what he says defines himself physically and his motivation. you can search history. i cannot think of one and i actually -- this is not a rhetorical question. i have been looking for a week and a half now. come on twitter and let me know what is. melinda, some perspective? >> absolutely. and what you said before, this didn't happen 600 years ago. this is all new. 600 years ago there were two popes and one of them finally threw in the towel. this situation has actually never happened in the history of the church and i quite agree. >> that sign said your humility has moved me. it was very great. obviously a referral of an italian to his stepping down. again, a nod to what is so unusual about this. an interesting thing to note.
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why is he at castel gandolfo. because he wants another weekend before the other guy comes in? no. he wants to absent himself from the conclave. this is an outward gesture that he is not part of this. important, important. >> they want to make sure that other cardinals can't come or have the perception that they would be coming to talk to him or seek his advice in any sort of way, right? >> absolutely. and what he said this morning to the cardinals was that he would be praying in a particular way for them. and hearing him refer to his own successor and the next pope sitting in the room was a poignant moment. but that he was going to withdraw from the scene so that there would be no impression, as you say, that he would possibly be involved. >> when you say pray in a particular way, do we know what that means? >> well, the whole church at this point is invited to be praying for the new pope. beginning in -- at 2:00 p.m. eastern time we'll no longer mention pope benedict's name during mass other than to pray
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for him in his retirement. but in the place we normally pray for the pope at mass, we'll now skip that part and we won't be praying for the pope until a new pope is elected. but the church is -- church throughout the world is encouraged to pray now for the cardinals as they prepare to elect a new pope. >> so you're going to put that into the service, into mass? >> yeah, you're going to have to. >> wow. >> you're going to want to. >> of course. >> as grand as this is looking at this, the cnn belief blog person that we have, good old eric who we rely on, he wrote a wonderful article on our cnn blog about the residence being prepared. we've heard about it as a monastery, a convent. it's the old gardener's house. you think of something so grand that he's moving into that they're getting ready. >> where he goes after this. while he's staying here, it's getting readied. i thought it was going to be a big monastery and this lush thing. gardener's house that some of
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the nuns use, has some small gardens. but it's not a palatial edifice at all. >> i wouldn't be surprised if he changes his mind about that. i just wonder what that's going to be like to have the pope and the pope emeritus so close. not that i believe in any way that benedict, as i said before, would try to still exercise any authority over this pope. because i think he's quite happy not to do that. but i do think for others it might be so awkward that i'm not sure -- i'm not -- i wouldn't be surprised if they thought again about that. >> so we talk about the future of the church, i want to bring in two people as we watch the pope here. is he coming to the actual balcony right now? he may be so i don't want to do that and have to interrupt. it looks like he may be approaching the balcony too. yes, he is. no? >> he's approaching one very lucky photographer. all right, here he is. >> there he is. >> that was the papal
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photographer. i guess who he'll only have another two hours.
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>> translator: i am happy to enjoy your sympathy. i give thanks for your friendship and for your affection. you do know that this is a different day for me than earlier days. i am no longer the pope, but i'm still in the church. i'm just a pilgrim who is starti starting the last part of his pilgrimage on this earth. and with all my heart and prayer
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and love and with my thoughts and strengths, i would like to work for the common good and the good of the church and mankind, and i feel very much supported by your sympathy. we'll go together ahead with the lord for the good of the church and the world. thank you all very much. so accept my blessing. may god bless you in the name of the father, the son and the holy spirit. thank you all and good night. thank you all. >> and i think we should say this could be the final time that we will ever see him in public again. he is choosing a life of
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monastacism so this could be the last time we ever see the pope. i thought that was very emotional when he said i'm a pilgrim, just starting the last part of my pilgrimage on this earth, but a pilgrim like everyone else now. >> melinda, you've been a student of him. to me it seemed emotive for him. >> very much so. it's a little bit overwhelming i'm sure for everyone in the square too. look at their faces. as he's withdrawing. it was interesting when he said a day or two ago that he was really, you know, giving up his privacy for the papacy forever and that he still would not be a private person, even in his retirement. and i felt that there was perhaps some regret in that, that he feels that even in a life of prayer he's never going to get the privacy back that he
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enjoyed before becoming pope. >> i don't think that he can be completely removed. >> right. and i think he will be seen out -- i don't want to say out and about. but you will see him in rome. >> you do think we'll see him? >> yes. >> not right away, i don't think. but i'm wondering will the new pope cross the courtyard and consult with him about some things, plain privately? >> i don't know why he wouldn't. >> would that be all right with you? >> why not use the wealth of that experience and that intellect to help you. >> we're looking here. this is a still photo, if you want to bring it back up, this was his final wave to those in the vatican courtyard before he got on the helicopter of this was his goodbye to rome. >> and you know it is amazing that there is a papal photographer. i believe his name is fernando, he's been with him for years and with him in every single moment. every time he meets a head of state, like barack obama, he was
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there. whether it be the cardinals and he was there for those last moments. >> and chris said the great photographer, what a shot. >> he's a very lucky guy. here's something interesting we can play off and i want to bring in sister mary hughes, that the pope will be taken care of by some laywomen who are part of an order. they are going to help attend to his needs. it does bring up the issue of women in the church and what may happen going forward. sister mary hughes, thank you for joining us. you are about with an episcopal priest. but going forward, what is your prayer and wish for the life of women in the church? >> i think women in general in terms of the church and all areas of life are looking for places where they can use the gifts that god gave them. i think going forward, we would hope that like in the early church when they often said who is it who has the gifts and will they put them at the service of the church, that there might be greater opportunities not only
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for women but for all laypersons to work together with our elected and appointed church leaders for the sake of the kingdom of god. >> sister, the question, i'll give you a chance to think about it because i want to direct this to what's going on, on camera, but do you believe their position should be elevated? should they be priests? how do you think they should serve as clergy? we're watching the papal seal of pope benedict xvi. it is being removed. it is a practical and a ceremonial, symbolic significance. this is the removal of him as pope. this is another outward sign of that. we will not see that seal again. there will be a new one created for the new pope. back to you, sister. what is the answer to that question? what do you believe about women serving in higher capacities as clergy? >> you know that that's one of the areas that is really off limits to talk about at this moment in time, so if i can skirt around that question rather deliberately, i would say what i still look for is for women to be able to use their
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gifts in a variety of ways. as leaders of prayer, perhaps in the preaching, to participate in whatever ways they can to build the community of faith. >> father, i want to bring you in because your personal story, i want to ask you how you felt today with the moment. you're someone who was a priest, you fell in love with a woman, you still are part of the catholic church but you ended up making a different choice. how did you feel today watching this moment? >> well, i had the privilege of meeting pope benedict on several occasions and i always was struck by his humility. a man that was very much an intellectual in the church for many, many years. one of the experts in vatican ii that's rarely talked about, but he was. so even though he's perceived as a much more conservative man now, he had been a very progressive theologian earlier on in his life. when i see him resign, i think part of that innovation from the past came back. you know, he said i'm going to
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do this differently. there are many stories out there about why he resigned. eventually we'll know the whole truth about that. but i would like to say that today i think anglicans and episcopalians are praying for the pope asking god to protect and guide the church in the future. it's important for all of us as christians as believers to know that spiritual leaders matter. it impacted some in a positive way and others have negative perceptions but in the end he's a religious leader that makes an impact on the world and the next pope will also make a great impact on the world. >> father, we're watching pope benedict now, still pope for a couple more hours. he is coming out to wave. we believe he's going to take -- oh, this is tape from earlier. i thought he was going to come out and do his little pope tour. but this is from earlier on, him leaving the vatican. this is earlier tape, this isn't happening right now. let me get back to you, father. when you made your big move and all the attention that got it.
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i'm one of many journalists that covered it. it turns out that it is not that unusual. it is somewhat of a back door path for anglicans to move into catholicism. you did the opposite, obviously. do you think that you will prove to be some type of pioneer that moving forward with a new pope, with change in the catholic church, the ability to have love in your life with the opposite sex or whomever you choose may be part of the priesthood for catholics? >> i think it's already happening. it's already happening. there are many married roman catholic priests and there are many married catholic priests in the eastern rites of the church. now some of the brothers from our communion, from the anglican communion are becoming romans for different reasons and for different ideological reasons and the pope is accepting them with their wives and their children. so obviously there is a change going on. it is not the change that i think most priests want. i get letters every day and e-mails every day from priests
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who would like to be married men. who would like to be married right now and serve adds roman catholic priests. some of them have hidden relationships, some of them have hidden children, believe it or not, and live in very painful situations. so i think i can speak for them because they cannot speak for themselves openly that, yes, many, many roman catholic priests would like to see their lives fulfilled through marriage and family and many catholic sisters and women would like to have the possibility of being ordained. why not? you know, the women were the first witnesses of the resurrection. they were the first ones to preach christ. so why not ordain women into the priesthood and as bishops. >> that's an interesting point, father. let me bring that back here. melinda, you were making a point about women priests. obviously sister mary hughes has to avoid it given the rules of church behavior and discipline. what is the unknown factor for women that may be a mystery for people. >> the thing that a lot of people don't realize is that the
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thing they could do without changing any rule is they could actually appoint women as cardinals. >> even though they can't be priests or bishops. >> that's right. women cannot be priests, women cannot be bishops but women can be cardinals. and there's a lot of talk now about the next pope maybe being in a position to improve the perception that the catholic church is so closed off to women by taking advantage of this reality that, yes -- >> why is that possible, by the way? can anybody answer that question? whether you follow the church movings or not. how can you not be a priest, not be a bishop but be a cardinal? >> it's a loophole. we're all familiar with that term. >> you can actually be a layperson and be a cardinal. >> what about -- >>
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pope benedict himself appointed a couple of years ago when he created new cardinals named a few -- they were all retired priests who were theologianses. they were all over 80 at the time, so they won't be voting. >> you're both in the priesthood here and you're not married. he has made a different choice. he says priests would wanted to marry. >> there are some priests that would want to marry. some people don't understand, there's two kinds of priests. religious priests, franciscans, jesuits. the vows make up our life. celibacy, if even if it was changed, they could choose -- because it's a discipline for them, they promise themselves to, but they don't take a vow of poverty. they could support a wife and kids. so, it's a very different thing. if there was optional celibacy,
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you would have a group of priests in the roman catholic church that would be celibate. >> that's discuss what this means for the pope and the church going forward. we'll take a break here on the day of the final farewell.
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♪ looking at st. peter's in rome. the pope has left there. he went out on the balcony to cheers of the crowds, spoke from castel gandolfo. he was relatively emotional. we'll give you a sense of what he said a moment ago. >> translator: i am no longer the pope.
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but i'm still in the church. i'm just a pilgrim who is starting the last part of pilgrimage on this earth. >> i loved that line, last pilgrimage on this earth. but he is still the pope for a couple more hours. >> over the next couple of hours, i guess he has dinner, you were saying, he has a dinner and then -- >> and then retire early. >> retire early. because he can. >> because he can. we were talking earlier about what it takes to be a cardinal. mr. couple muomo, if you were n married, you could be elected pope. >> one more reason marriage brings you down. >> but if you were, they would ordain you immediately, make you a bishop -- >> so you're saying if he were not married and a priest, he could still be a pope? >> any catholic --
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>> you're going to make his head so big. >> don't say it like that mocks the whole idea. you're like, if this guy could be pope, why do you even have one? >> that's why i shudder to think of it. >> i didn't bring it up. he did. >> luckily we're exempted from it. we think the church is in turmoil now. we still have christiane back there? >> reporter: yes, you do. >> i just want to distract talk from me being pope for a minute. those saying they will never see pope benedict again, the mood, the thoughts, what are you feeling? >> well, listen, the sun has set on st. peter's. the sun has set on castel gandolfo and the sun has set on the papacy of pope benedict xvi. he said it 2 1/2 hours before his papacy officially ends, as you mentioned, he said, i am no longer pope.
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i am a simple pilgrim. he blessed everybody. it was amazing in the square there, they had signs up. you saw the balloons saying, benedict, we are with you, all these signs. it was probably the biggest outpouring affection for him in his entire papacy. >> i felt so pleased for him and grateful that so many showed up. he spoke from the heart once again. these are heartfelt talks yesterday and today. really, they are. as the sun sets in rome there's a very famous italian hymn that is be with us lord, it is nearly evening. the lord is with us in a new way. we don't exactly know with what leader but the lord is always with us, as the pope told us yesterday. and that, i think, is really our consolation. >> now, do we know when you say he has -- as christiane said, he has another 2, 2 1/2 hours of pope, who is he with right now?
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we don't know? >> his private secretary. and probably the household staff that will take care of him. it didn't look like there were too many other people accompanying him. >> no, it didn't. you saw some but didn't look like very many people. >> there is real retirement, even though a pope has never gone through it before. i was told that he gets 2500 euros a month. the vatican said all of his needs will be taken care of. i don't know what he needs pocket -- what he needs money for. but they're trying to put some normal expectations around this. you know, this has to be recognized as something that was not unorthodoxed. this has to be recognized as something that's okay so he's going to get a retirement stipend. not a pension. he doesn't get a pension, which we'll understand. he'll get that. they'll take care of him. >> john berman was saying this morning he was working